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2004 BF225 ECM

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Scubagrog

Contributing Member
Had trouble with check engine light bieing on and getting error codes off my 2004 BF225 and after walking through the repair manual, it says I need to replace the ECM. Looking on boats.net, it gives the part as 34750-ZY3-043, however the part that came off was 34750-ZY3-023. I assume at some point it was superceded. I found an ECM that has that model number on eBay, but the listing said it came off of a bf200. Looking up the ECM for a 2004 BF200 on the same site shows the same part number. Is it OK to simply replace the part or does something else need to be done as far as programming it? How does one go about getting it reprogrammed if this is the case?
 
I can't answer your specific question. However, based on the traffic on this forum and others, it is very rare for a Honda 200/225 ECM to fail. I would go back and double check the procedure that indicated you needed to re[place the ECM. That is the default for about every test procedure in the manual.
 
I actually stepped through it twice on Friday, just to be sure. I had gone through it because the light was on with no blinking. Kind of funny that the engine seems to run OK, (not jumps or sputters). I decided to take it out on the lake Saturday (have sea tow, because I have an old boat). It seemed to run OK. Today (Monday afternoon), I decided to plug in the short plug and noticed that the light stays on, but varies brightness just a little bit, blinking out error 13 (BARO sensor related) and error 21 (VTEC Solenoid Valve related). I'll try uploading to YT if that's allowed. I guess after running it the other day, it collected those codes). However, the light never totally goes off until the key is removed. I did the procedure to clear the codes (the kill switch 5 times), and the light still comes on, just doesn't get brighter/dimmer. I feel better that the light does blink, but wish it would turn off when the codes are cleared. Any ideas why it seems to have 2 levels of brightness and not just on/off? (BTW, the alternator light goes off when the engine runs)

Here's a vid
 
Was that video taken with the shunt on the service connector in place? With the shunt in place, if the MIL comes on, then stays on, there are no codes in the EPROM. This is contrary to what it implies in the Helm Shop Manual (Page 5-14.)

HOWEVER, looking at the video, I'm seeing code 13 (long, short, short, short - disconnected BARO sensor, short or open circuit in BARO sensor wire, or faulty BARO sensor) and code 21 (long, long, short - disconnected VTEC solenoid valve connector, short or open circuit in VTEC solenoid valve wire, or faulty VTEC solenoid.)

I assume that you tested both IAW the procedures in the manual, is that correct?

I didn't hear any alarms. Were there any?
 
Yes, the service connector was shunted. Those are the codes I was seeing, too. I haven't stepped through those sections in the manual (the chart referred to some pages in section 5, like around 5-30 something, but I don't have the manual with me to make sure). It was getting late and due to the rain we've had lately, the mosquitoes were out with a vengeance. From what I see on the parts diagram on Boats dot net, the part for the baro sensor is the same as a MAP sensor on the manifold, it is just packed in around the main relay. Is it really the same part? I guess both just monitor air pressure, so no use in reinventing the wheel, huh? BTW,What does the VTEC solenoid valve actually do? From what I see in the manual about it, it appears to be what boats.net is calling a Valve Assembly, Spool *NH8*(Dark Gray) part number 15810-ZY3-003ZA on the cylinder block diagram. Am I reading that right? I know I should go through the tests and make sure whether it is the part or just the connections, but just wondering if I'm reading/interpreting things correctly. Sometimes things get called something in one place and something else in others.
 
The BARO sensor is one of the inputs the ECU relies upon to determine whether or not the VTEC solenoid is engaged at 4500 rpm.

Here is a link to the old Helm Shop Manual. It's in PDF format and can be searched.
http://planbmarine.com/wp-content/u...ice-workshop-and-repair-BF175A-BF200A-BF2.pdf

The procedure for testing the BARO sensor starts on page 5-37.

The procedure for testing the VTEC sensor starts on page 5-43.

From page 18-16 in the old Helm shop manual....

VTEC System (BF225A)
The VTEC system switches the valve timing and valve lift between low-and high-speed settings to maximize the amount
of intake air in all ranges, thus exploiting the full potential of the engine throughout its entire operating range from high
speeds to low speeds.

The VTEC arrangement consists of three rocker arms for each cylinder (primary, secondary and mid rocker arms; syn-
chronizing pistons; low-speed high-speed cams; a VTEC solenoid valve; and ECM.

When the engine is operating in the low-speed range, the VTEC solenoid valve is closed, blocking the hydraulic pres-
sure passage to the synchronizing piston incorporated in the rocker arms. Each rocker arm is driven by its low-speed
cam independently of the other rocker arm. When the engine is operating in the high-speed range, the VTEC solenoid
valve opens, allowing hydraulic pressure to be applied to the synchronizing piston. The synchronizing piston then
moves and links the three rocker arms together. As a result, all the rocker arms are moved by the high-lift high-speed
cam that drives the mid rocker arm.

The VTEC system switches from the low-speed cams to the high-speed cams when all of the following conditions are
satisfied.

At least two seconds have elapsed since engine startup.
A forward or reverse gear selection has been made. (The neutral switch is OFF.)
The engine temperature (as indicated by the engine temperature sensor) is -20°C (28.4"F)or higher.
The engine speed is 4,500 rpm or higher.
There is no low-pressure alert. (The high-pressure oil switch is ON.)
The high-pressure oil switch is not faulty.
The system switches back from the high-speed cams to the low-speed cams when the engine speed drops to 4,300 rpm.
 
Thanks for posting that, it's nice to have it in PDF to be able to look stuff up when you're away from home. It appears to be a little different from my shop manual. The one I have refers to 5-65 for the BARO and 5-69 for the VTEC valve, but it is just for the BF200 and BF225 and doesn't have the 175 like the one you posted. It does have the VTEC write up in the same section, though. Thanks for the write up.
 
Just noticed the test walkthrough are presented a little differently, as well. The one you posted has the flowchart style. Mine is just in list form.
 
The manual i posted was for European Honda models, which included the 175, which was never sold in the US to the best of my knowledge.
 
Oh, and the answer to your question a few posts back. No beeps other than the initial ones on the self test. I was also not getting any when started in the yard on earmuffs (but got the CE light), but the alarm was not hooked up Sat when I went out and (I think) caused those codes, which would probably go along with all the stuff which you mention seems to get used at around 4500 rpms. It may have been trying to beep at that point (I replaced the main extension harness the next day from the engine to the gauge wiring harness because I had figured out that there was a short in the buzzer wire, but it was replaced when I filmed the vid above. All other wires in the old harness seemed to have continuity.
 
Managed to walk through the test for the BARO sensor, and got down to replace it and retest. I haven't walked through the VTEC valve one yet because it involves running the engine at 5000 rpm for a bit and I don't want to do that on earmuffs in the yard). BTW, I also got ahold of an ECM. It's the same model as what boats.net says is for the BF225, but I found out it came from a BF200. I don't know enough about ECMs to know if they have to be programmed after you get them or if they come with whatever programming is needed from the factory. (boats.net also confirms the part numbers for the BF200 is the same part number). Anyway, I swapped it out and when I turned the key to on (with the short connector), it gave an error 1. I cleared the codes that were on it (it's used, so I don't know if the other motor had issues, my old ECM doesn't give that error). After clearing, it behaves the same way as the my old one after I cleared the codes with the CE light in the gauge staying on (after clearing codes nothing flashes, just a steady glow), so I'm wondering if there may be an issue with the CE gauge (not sure how, it seems like the light is on or not, but since there are 2 brightnesses, maybe something is crossed up with the wiring inside it). I'm thinking at this point like you mentioned earlier that it is likely not the ECM.

I haven't been able to find anything about the programming of ECMs other than some folks trying to find out how to program their ECM for their Xhp motor to be a Yhp motor. Seems like the general answer was that you shouldn't do that, but that there were some items from custom programing shops that were available. I also didn't see anything about having to flash one right after you bought a new Honda part, so that would lead me to believe that the programming in the one I bought should be OK. (will probably just use it as a part to compare against).
 
Looks like I misspoke on the other ECM and the CE light behavior...... When I had had the ignition key on with it in, I also had it shorted. The CE light being on and not blinking when shorted is the sign that everything's good. I thought about that today and "new" ECM in and when I turned the key with the short out, the CE light goes off after 2 sec as it should. The old one still stays lit. So with the only thing being different being the ECM, the old one has the light coming on, so it appears it is dirty in this situation (the other codes may likely be a thing too, but i've got to get out and run it to be sure. Now the big question is the one I just got OK to run in this motor?
 
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