Logo
FULL SITE MENU

HELP with Espar heaters

Hi Brian Silk and greetings from Ireland. I am new to this site and having difficulty sorting it out . however here goes I have a 3DLC model and have the general ref manual. I started the unit recently and all went fine and selected shutdown and normal sequence until after roughly 3 mins I went to switch the unit off and not quite sure about this, whether the lights came on with switch on or off BUT the lights flashed as in glow plug operating sequence and then stopped. I could hear the boat transformer slowly rising in humming noise ( meaning high current draw ) and I selected on cycle which unit did start sequence but did not ignite and auto shutdown. The transformer hum was still there and when I removed the 25a fuse it stopped. When I went to replace the fuse there is a large current draw with the switch OFF. Hope you understand this and appreciate any comments or solutions
 
Hi Brian, I have a D3l on my new to me boat. I believe it is of the 1987 vintage. The fan would work on the boat, but nothing happened when I turned it to heat mode. It took the unit out and took apart the heater. After cleaning it up a little it appears to work fine and the fan draws about 2 amps when I apply power to it. there was an internal gasket that was burned out but the rest of the unit appears in good shape. It has a silver control box that I suspect may be bad. Is there any way to check this to see if it works correctly? Also, how would I check to see if the boat is wired correctly. there is power to the harness but not sure how the rest of it works.
 
Hi,

We have a new to us boat, a 1978 Camper & NIcholsons 44 Ketch, that we live aboard. We previously had a 35ft Wauquiez with a 3500 Espar air heater, although we never lived aboard in cold climes.
This winter We have committed to staying in Annapolis, MD for the winter. Right now it is about 35 degrees out, and it is the beginning of the winter. Electric space heaters are not going to cut it.

Brian, I am interested in your opinion on a suitable system. I am quite handy, so installation is not much of a concern. Choosing the right system is, especially as we are $$$ strapped at the moment, at least until the Wauquiez sells http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/198...64833/Annapolis/MD/United-States#.UpUn-eJhuso ;>

Hydronic or air is the first question I guess. We have a good sized engine compartment mid-ships, and the original drawings we have show a Webasto there. There are also already two grills for air, one at the settee in the saloon, and the other in the aft cabin. We are ok with just heating to those grills to get us through the winter. For either hydronic or air, my gut and research tells me that I need something with a bit more heat output than either of the 5kw units from Webasto or Espar. Of course, anything larger starts to cost real $$$. Or am I wrong? Two electric heaters on full are barely keeping up in 30+ degree weather, and the water temp is still relatively warm.

Being able to adjust the heat in the zones I see as a plus for hydronic. Also good is domestic hot water and diverted engine heat in the future. Sure marine says on their website that forced air is not good for live aboard? Any lower cost options for bigger heat? For example, there are some Proheat 45,000 btu units on ebay I have seen.

Thanks in advance,
Chris
 
Good day. When you say shutdown sequence. What do you mean? All that had to be done is turn off the main on/off switch on the thermostat, it is all automatic . When you turn off the switch, the fuel shuts off and the glow plug goes on for awhile as a chamber cleaner. You may hear the fan speed pulse, and your charger may pulse as well. The glow plug regulator cuts the current off and then back on so that the glow plug dies not get too hot. It will then shut off and continue cool down for a couple of minutes.When you pulled the fuse, was the fan still running? When you put the fuse back in did the fan go on as well? I have never pulled the fuse like that so cannot tell you what it will do when put back in. Is the glow plug cutting out when you start up the furnace? After about 2 min. *
What happened after you put the fuse in, did it continue in cool down, irvdidvyou pull the fuse
 
Good day. When you say shutdown sequence. What do you mean? All that had to be done is turn off the main on/off switch on the thermostat, it is all automatic . When you turn off the switch, the fuel shuts off and the glow plug goes on for awhile as a chamber cleaner. You may hear the fan speed pulse, and your charger may pulse as well. The glow plug regulator cuts the current off and then back on so that the glow plug dies not get too hot. It will then shut off and continue cool down for a couple of minutes.When you pulled the fuse, was the fan still running? When you put the fuse back in did the fan go on as well? I have never pulled the fuse like that so cannot tell you what it will do when put back in. Is the glow plug cutting out when you start up the furnace? After about 2 min. *
What happened after you put the fuse in, did it continue in cool down, irvdidvyou pull the fuse? Brian.
 
Good day. When you say shutdown sequence. What do you mean? All that had to be done is turn off the main on/off switch on the thermostat, it is all automatic . When you turn off the switch, the fuel shuts off and the glow plug goes on for awhile as a chamber cleaner. You may hear the fan speed pulse, and your charger may pulse as well. The glow plug regulator cuts the current off and then back on so that the glow plug dies not get too hot. It will then shut off and continue cool down for a couple of minutes.When you pulled the fuse, was the fan still running? When you put the fuse back in did the fan go on as well? I have never pulled the fuse like that so cannot tell you what it will do when put back in. Is the glow plug cutting out when you start up the furnace? After about 2 min. *
What happened after you put the fuse in, did it continue in cool down, irvdidvyou pull the fuse?
 
Can you call me at 604-312-9566 please. I am really swamped with heater work at the moment and can deal with your problem faster over the phone. Thanks, Brian.
 
Can you call me on my cell. 694-312-9566. I am really swamped and the back and forth emails rake too much time for me at this time of year. Thanks, Brian
 
Hi Brian, I am in Abbotsford I purchased a old D5L that wish to try and get going I brought it to A Espar dealer (Cool It) and they seem to know very little about the older units. would you be interested in working on it ?
 
Hello Brian I have had no reply or contact with you and wonder if you got mt thread. I have tried to ring you from Ireland to cell number 694-318-9566 and call will not go through. If this reply gets to you please advise how we can communicate if/when you have the time
 
Hi Path, I can see where you got the 694- number in message #188, but if you take a look at the message just before that, the phone number begins 604- which is appropriate for Vancouver.
Dan
 
Brian, looks like you know a lot about Espar heaters. I have a Hyrdronic 10 24V in my boat that I run off a 12V to 24V converter. It keep burning through glow pins. They last about half a dozen to a dozen times and then burn through. Espar customer service suspected that the cheap DC converter might cause overvoltages especially when on shore power - even though my measurements did not confirm that. I replaced it with an expensive Samlex converter that outputs 24VDC for any input from 9-18VDC. With this new converter a plug burned through after the first attempt. Since that glow pin had been previously used and was also bulged when I removed it (the previous ones weren't) I got another replacement glow pin (the 4th) and measured voltage at the glow pin during the start. Voltage was a steady 14.4V until the heater had fired and the plug turned off. Once fired the heater works great for days on end. If this plug should not last despite the new voltage converter the only culprit could be the controller. Do you have any experience with 24V heaters running on DC converters burning glow pins? Is 14.4V correct for 24V heaters? I have not been able to get the design voltage from the Espar team. The glow pin reads 18VDC on it.
Any help with this would be greatly appreciated!
Cheers,
Jens
 
Hello - newly signed on. We had an old Espar D4L unit that started smelling like exhaust in the cabin. When I read online, they said the older generation units were known to have cracked burners, so I ordered a D5 for our 43' Shannon Ketch. We are just north of Annapolis as well and living aboard too. It's been quite cold this year. We too are operating on two radiators with fans going to circulate the air, because I can't dial in the new unit.
I ordered the new truck unit from Vancouver for half what it would cost stateside. The installation is straight-forward but I'm getting exhaust smells and fumes in the cabin - so I shut it down. I uninstalled everything to make sure I had everything properly seated - the exhaust elbow had an ever-so-small opening to leak, so I reseated the exhaust elbow, reinstalled everything and even moved the air intake away from the unit - we still have nasty fumes in the cabin and cannot use the Espar.

Any suggestions as to why it's doing this?

Tony Carey
sv Marite
443-336-6964
 
Hi Tony. Are you using the old exhaust, or is it new with new insulation? The new insulation will take many hours to fume off the wax on the insulation, which smells roughly like exhaust. If it is the old exhaust, then other than making sure it is not leaking, I cannot say. There is no way that a D5a would leak fumes. I assume a d5a, and you are using. Electric radiators that plug into the wall, or do you have a D5W? Also if it is a D5a, then check to make sure that there was no diesel that dripped on the ducting near the heater. That stumped me for ages once. It heats up and smells just like exhaust. Sorry not sure whether you meant D5A or D5w. You can call me if none if these solve anything. 604-312-9566 8-5 Monday to Friday PST.
 
Thanks Brian for getting back to me so quickly - I apologize I have the Airtronic D5L, May2012 . When I mention radiators to heat the boat - electric oil-filled Delonghi style.
I am using the previous exhaust installation. I figured there'd be a burn in time. I'm going to check the diesel drip - I'd be surprised.
Thanks for the contact # info - very kind of you.
 
Hi Brian,

Thanks for the great answers above. I am attempting to reset a locked out D5L, and the only place I found a good answer was above. However, I still can't get the unit reset. When I went to jumper the #4 and #6 pins on the thermostat (old style analog unit), I realized nothing was connected to #4, (yellow is on #6). So I jumpered at the plastic plugs by the heater itself from #9 to #11 on the main ECU plug. Though the green light did indeed flicker for a split second longer than usual, nothing came on. (No blower or anything.) I'm jumpering a black wire with white stripe to the yellow wire.

The unit has worked great for about a year until a couple days ago, when it wouldn't go past the first stage blower only. I tried 3 or 4 times (it would cycle through about ten minutes each time) but then finally gave up and now does nothing. At this point, I'm just trying to get it out of locked phase so I can troubleshoot the no-start issue!

Thanks very much for your help.

Tripp
 
Hi Brian: I have a 32' Bayliner with a diesel Espar heater and it stopped working. On the main switch the fan goes on when I switch to Vent but when I switch On to heat nothing happens. Could this be the thermostat?
 
Hello. If you had the jumper in place and turned it on, it should unlock, or at least bring up the flash code. Is there a blue wire on the thermostat? It may be something that can't be unlocked. Only a 5 failed start, or 5 overheats in a row can be unlocked. Check the solder blobs on the back of the pc board on top if the heater. Look at them with a magnifying glass and see if you can see a circle around any if the pins where they poke through the solder blobs. A bad solder on the flame sensor is very common and will cause a flame sensor open circuit code.shoukd come up from the jumper though. Also check voltage at the heater before and after turn on, check the glow plug for continuity, and try moving the fan blade on the blower. If the commutator had a bad spot on it sometimes this will move the brushed off it and it may work temporarily. Check all power and fuel pump electrical connections ad well.
 
I assume it is a D3L. Unplug the thermostat plug at the heater. White 6 pin plug. Make a jumper with a female spade terminal on both ends and jump black to black with white stripe. Then out another between red and yellow. This should start the furnace if the control box had 20 1607 on the front. If it does start then it probably is the thermostat. To shut it down, remove the red to yellow jumper and leave the other one in place until the furnace stops. Also it could be the rotary dial not sending positive to the thermostat. You should have positive going into the thermostat as well as a positive output returning to the yellow wire. The rotary dial also creates a jump between the black and black with white stripe. Hope that helps. I don't know what vintage if thermostat you have unless I see a picture I can't tell you exactly what terminals to test.
 
Brian,

There is a blue wire going to the thermostat -- it's landed on #3.

I will check your list tomorrow. The PC board you are referring to is located within the heater enclosure itself, correct? I have to take the long cover held with one allen head bolt off and disconnect the black connector to remove it? Does it slide right out?

Could I also (with a D5L) bypass the thermostat with black/black-white and red/yellow jumpers, just to eliminate the thermostat?

Thanks again

Tripp
 
Still don't know what thermostat you have. Does it have an led on it? As far as the pc bd. Yes, unplug the black plug and you will see three 2 pin plugs. Motor to the right. Overheat (green wires), and to the left, the flame sensor(blue wires) unplug them and push down on the right side of the pc bd(there is a kind of catch there) and pull it out. You could do a resistance check on the blue wires, should be between 900-1100 ohms,when at room temp.
You cannot make the heater go by jumping it. I don't think. You could try jumping yellow to red, sorry having a brain fart about this, as I always have a fault reader. Send me an email and I will send you a copy of the trouble shooting manual. [email protected]
 
Hi Brian: The thermostat doesn't have an LED and when I turned the dial I used to hear a click indicating the cabin temp. Now there doesn't seem to be a click when I turn it. I'm going to take some pictures and post them hear. I appreciate your help!

Thank you!

Jonathan
SeaQuest
Richmond, BC
 
If you have a d3l and it has 20 1607 on the ecu,/ control box) then the thermostat should click. If it does not then it is not connecting the red to yellow wires at the heater. What are the other colours at the thermostat? How many wires are there? If there are two, jump them together, if three then out a meter on them, one will be ground and one positive, and the third will be the return which connects red to yellow. If you connect the positive with the third, it is the same as the relay closing, which is what the click WAS. If the thermostat is defective then get a Honeywell Pro 1000 battery operated thermostat and connect the positive to the R terminal, and the third non ground wire to the W terminal. This will connect the red to yellow, and should start the furnace.
 
I;m posting some pictures so you can see what kind of thermostat I have. Pic1 copy.jpgPic2 copy.jpgPic3 copy.jpgPic4 copy.jpgPic5 copy.jpgPic6 copy.jpg
 
Thanks. Yes. The brown should be ground. See if you have 12 v on the red and brown, with the rotary dial in heat position. If yes then see if you have 12v if you put the meter on brown. And grey? When you turn up the thermostat. If yes. Then the thermostat is ok. If not, then jump red and grey together. That should start the furnace. Have you tried the two jumpers at the 6 pin plug yet?
 
Brian,

I seem to be making some progress. I installed a long jumper from t-stat terminal 4 to control unit terminal 11, and this allowed me to start the heater. Now it's time to actually troubleshoot.

Jumping terminal 4 to 6 gives one long blink and 3 short, indicating "safety time exceeded no start". (Actually, this happened once, and now I seem to have entered some sort of ventilation only mode, where the blower comes on, but nothing else tries to start. Is there anything I could have done to stop if from trying to heat?)

I also checked the following:
Glow plug (resistance OK, relay clicking as normal, tried to start with glow plug outside of unit and got a nice red glow).
Resistance on flame sensor (just under 1100 ohms -- ok per your note above).
Visual check of PC board -- surprisingly clean for age, with all solder connections looking really good.
Disconnected exhaust for inspection -- no soot buildup whatsoever.
Disconnected air inlet, visual check of air outlet -- both clean.
Disconnected and cleaned terminals at fuel metering pump (see below).
No way of checking thermo-safety cutoff switch, but I don't think this is the problem.

Now, when I turn the heater on, the fan blows and the glow plug relay clicks (again, this happened a couple times, but now it just blows cold air and doesn't try to light the glow plug). During the times it tried to start heating, I had a voltmeter connected to the fuel metering pump, and after about a minute, I got 1-2 volts to the pump, but the pump did not turn on (no clicking) and no fuel moved through the clear fuel line. This makes me think the fuel metering pump is the issue (though I'm not sure why it's only 1-2 volts).

After a few minutes, the voltage went away and the heater shut down.

Do you concur that the metering pump is the culprit? Are there any other checks to make sure of this (can I supply 12 volts direct to pump and see if it turns on?) Where is my best place to source a new pump? Is this something I can purchase direct from you? Is the pump model specific or can I purchase one off ebay (here, for example: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Espar-Fuel-...her_Vehicle_Parts&hash=item461980234c&vxp=mtr)

Thanks for your help,

Tripp
 
Last edited:
Update: I jumped 12V directly to the fuel pump. I learned that the pump functions by a constant switching on/off of the voltage, throwing a solenoid that pumps a small amount of fuel with each switch. After a couple dozen manual jumps (verifying that fuel flows each time), I reconnected the ECU wires to the pump and attempted another start. Low and behold it fired right up. I think the pump must have been gunked up and needed a higher amperage to get it cleared out. If it happens again I'm going to take the pump off and give it a good clean.

Thanks for the help, Brian. The troubleshooting manual helped a great deal, if only for the wiring diagram that showed me how to extract the fault codes.
 
Sorry. I was at the boat show and taking the booth down.didnt get time to read the last post. You got it. Very rare but got the same thing on a service call Saturday am. It could be good from now on. You can wack the pump hard and it will free up most of the time. It may do it again. If so I would get a new pump. 25 1729 45. It was a D5l, correct?
 
No worries, Brian. Hope the boat show was a success.

It is a D5L. I'll record the part number just in case. What is my best part source? I'm in the Boston area.

Tripp
 
Back
Top